Rhombic's Complete Community Day Report

[rhombic21]

First, I want to thank Will Kinsler (aka RAC) for putting on a great event. We got an unprecedented amount of hands on time with the games, and had tremendous access to producers. In total we played NCAA, Head Coach, and Madden for over 25 hours in two days. That said, keep in mind that as much game time as Will got us, it's still a limited amount of time to evaluate games like NCAA and Madden, so as the community gets its hands on the game after release, you guys will have the ability to log far more hours than we did, and may find different/more nuanced things. We tried as hard as possible to cover as many bases as we could, and answer as many of your questions as we had time to do, but obviously we can't completely break the game down to the last line of code in only two days.

Before I jump into the meat of the report, I wanted to spend a little time trying to give you a sense of what being at a community day is like. Essentially what happens is that at about 10 AM we head over to the studio and they put us in a conference room with roughly 15 TVs set up. Then we more or less get unlimited access to the games for the rest of the day. During that time, producers come down and walk around to watch people play and get feedback about the game or to answer questions/give interviews. This year we had a two day event that had NCAA on Day 1 and Madden on Day 2, although after 8 PM on Day 2 a couple guys put in builds of NCAA and played that again. On Day 1 we arrived at the studio at 10 AM and did not leave until after 11 PM. We ate lunch and dinner in the room, and essentially only stopped playing the game to talk to producers or go to the bathroom. It was basically the same setup on Day 2 except several of us stayed a little later, since we didn't have to do anything but fly home the next day. So for over 25 hours in a two day span, we more or less locked ourselves in the studio and played the game until we couldn't keep our eyes open or move our thumbs anymore, which is an exhausting experience (both physically and mentally). I really hope that you guys find our impressions helpful, and enjoy some of the multi-media that we were able to capture and bring back.



Gameplay

I know that gameplay is the most important thing to most people (including me), so let's start there. I already posted a lot of my gameplay thoughts in my initial impressions post, but I'd like to expand on them.

NCAA 09 does a lot of things really well. The gameplay is smooth overall and feels much more like last-gen, if last-gen had a realistic momentum/player weight system. One of the things that the producers told us is that they changed the way speed works, so that rather than a linear difference between players, there's actually more of a curved approach, such that elite speed players (95+) are actually considerably faster than even guys with 90 speed. The result is that you truly get that wide open, gamebreaking type feeling when one of these guys gets the ball in space. Last year I felt like you could get the ball in a guy like Percy Harvin's hands, and you wouldn't really feel the speed difference between him and other players, and that's definitely not the case this year. Fast players FEEL fast, and it's done really well.

The playbooks got a lot of love too. They added a lot more pro-style type plays for under center sets, and many of the playbooks that I used with teams that use a pocket passer had very few option plays in them. We got a chance to talk to Anthony White, who is in charge of working on playbooks for NCAA and Madden, and he said that he added over 800 new plays, and tons of formations to the game. Additionally, the overall size of the playbooks was increased for each team, although I didn't take note as to how much. One of the big things that they did with the playbooks this year is to make more complementary plays, which gives the formations a more complete feeling. Anthony said that one of his major goals was to make sure that every running play had a play action pass off of that run action, and that every auto-motion play had at least a few others which gave the defense a similar pre-snap look. I'll talk more about my discussions with Anthony later, but the guy did a tremendous job this year, and has even bigger plans for NCAA next year (some of which are going to appear in Madden '09).

The running game felt really, really good. The option issues from '08 have been virtually eliminated, so no longer will the triple option be the bane of online play or result in skewed dynasty stats. Additionally, they added more depth to the running game by bringing in more diverse kinds of plays. In particular, they added Power O and Inside Zone plays. The result is that, from a playcalling perspective, I more or less felt like I could call most, if not all, of the kinds of running plays that I see teams run in real life.

Of course the big thing that they added this year with the run game is the new animation controls that allow you the ability to string together jukes/spins, and to make those moves more fluidly in the open field. I thought they pulled this off really, really well. It didn't feel overpowered at all, but yet I could definitely feel a big difference between '08, and it leads to a much more satisfying experience when controlling the running backs, because while you can't pull off crazy runs on command, you do have the ability to occasionally make an exciting play. The thing that impressed me was that even though the run blocking was improved, and user control over running backs in the open field was expanded, the run defense actually seemed more realistic/better than last year's. The developers put equal time in giving the defense the tools necessary to defend the run. Granted I didn't spend a ton of time breaking it down in instant replay mode, but I never really got the feeling that my guys were playing way out of their gaps or were giving up cheap plays. Bottom line, the run game experience, on both offense and defense, is the most realistic that I've ever seen in a football game.

I'm hesitant to post the next section, because I know that people have a tendency to cling on to the negative things and run with them until suddenly everybody is up in arms about how the game is horrible before it has even been released, but on the other hand I feel as though part of my job at these events is to give truthful impressions of gameplay – both positive and negative. The big negative that I felt was in the passing game. By now you've probably all read about the issues relating to the pass rush. Simply put, it often times feels as though it's almost non-existent. Not only with the down linemen, but also with blitzing players. That said, we only had a limited amount of time with the game, so maybe some of you will find some exotic blitz schemes after the game is released that get good pressure without completely sacrificing coverage. Additionally, we did attempt to play around with sliders to see if we could find a solution to the issue. Granted that we only spent a couple hours doing so, but we really didn't find anything that worked all that well – and frankly it felt as though the pass block slider was pretty useless. We didn't feel a major difference between 0 and 100, even on Heisman (at least in HUM-HUM games).

We talked to the producers about the issue, and many of them agreed that it was not where they wanted it to be, and that if they had the ability to do so they'd be in there right now trying to tune it and make it better, but they simply ran out of time and had to go final code and barring some sort of patch, that's just the way the game is. The really sad part about it is that in talking to many of the other guys at the event, we felt as though the lack of pass rush is literally the ONLY thing that keeps this game from being a 9.9-10.0 type of game.

In a couple days me and cdj are going to send some of our impressions for things that need to be addressed to the team, and it's probably not going to be a long list at all. The game is amazingly close to being perfect. IF the game gets patched (and the team was at least open to the idea of releasing a patch to address major gameplay issues such as this), it will be great. One thing to note about a patch, however, is that it's a fairly lengthy process, and it takes somewhere between a month to two months between the time that the team completes the patch to when it actually gets released to the public.

We had a couple other negative findings, that were more minor than the pass rush. The linebackers in hook zones (short yellow zones) seemed to drop back too far, which left the short middle pretty wide open on a consistent basis, which, when combined with the lack of pass rush, made it fairly easy to dink and dunk your way down the field on offense, and incredibly hard to stop the pass on defense (even against the computer). I saw a lot of games (both HUM-HUM and HUM-CPU) where both Qbs were completing nearly 80-85% of their passes, almost all of which was in the short to intermediate areas of the field. Also, kick returns seemed a bit overdone. Guys were getting out to the 40-45 yard line regularly, and we saw more than a few kick returns go to the house. It wasn't like it happened every single game, but it happened enough to feel a little overdone. The issue seemed to be related to poor angles taken by the outside coverage guys, who stayed outside for too long before closing in on the return man, which left a couple gaps up the middle.

Overall, NCAA '09 plays a lot better than '08 did, despite the issue with the pass rush. It's more fun to play, which is the ultimate criteria for any video game. If they patch the pass rush, or if users can find a set of sliders of blitz setups that generate more pressure on the passer, this could go down as one of the best sports games ever made.

Face to Face Time with Producers

As I mentioned earlier, the great thing about these events it that we not only get to play the games and give you guys impressions or answer questions, but we also get a chance to talk directly to the guys who make the game, and in many instances can show them first hand what we're experiencing that we enjoy or think needs to be tuned. Let me just say that these guys not only work extremely hard, but they genuinely care about making the game better. On Day 2 we stayed in studio until close to 2 AM, and until 1 AM, Phil Frazier, who is the lead producer on Madden, was down there talking to us and watching us play the game. Even those guys who didn't stick around all day walked around and took notes, and a couple times they would even see something that we pointed out and then go to their office and fix the problem immediately (at least for Madden, which is still being tweaked/tuned). Additionally, these guys know their stuff. They are very aware of what the issues are, and feel just as passionately about fixing them as we do – maybe even moreso. I really think that the whole “EA is lazy and doesn't care about the game” nonsense needs to stop, because it's an insult to the work and dedication that these guys put into making the game as good as it can be. The series is in GREAT hands, and as long as these guys are at EA, will continue to make incredible improvements each and every year, which is the most that anybody can reasonably ask for.

One of the highlights in talking with the producers was when Anthony White, who works on the playbooks for both NCAA and Madden, stopped by and talked to us. Guys, Anthony is incredible at what he does. He showed us the amazing time and effort that he puts into cataloging the plays and formations that teams use in real life, and then getting those plays into the game. He told us about some of the things he's planning to do with the playbooks for NCAA next year, and while I can't get into any specifics, I can say that it's going to be incredible. Some of the things that he's working on right now for Madden bring a level of depth to playcalling that we've simply never seen before, and I think you guys are really going to be impressed with the playbooks in both games. The really good thing is that Anthony has found some new techniques that allow him to get plays into the game much faster and more efficiently than he has been able to do in the past, so as we move forward to the 2010 games, he'll be able to get even more stuff into the game.

[neystar206]

do you think that we will get a patch for the pass rush and about how soon if so???

[rhombic21]

I honestly don't know if there will be a patch or not that can address the issue, or when it will be released. In talking with the producers it was something that they tried to tweak while the game was still open for tuning, and essentially the only two possibilities that they got were zero pass rush, like it is now, or having games where linemen were constantly breaking in and sacking the QB in less than 3 seconds.

My guess is that they might be able to do something to make it play better, just based on what I saw in Madden yesterday. As to whether they'll decide to do that or not or when that would get released, it remains to be seen. I think that ultimately they're going to have to completely redesign the OL/DL interactions for 2010, which is something that Ian Cummings has already admitted over at OS.

[MtneerManiac]

Originally Posted by neystar206

do you think that we will get a patch for the pass rush and about how soon if so???

1. Do not quote his whole post, it makes me scroll more.

2. He said that they were open to the idea, but it would take 1-2 months for it to even get finished if they were to do so, so it wouldn't exactly be released that soon after released.

[worst2first]

Was QB Auto-Throw even discussed? Why was this left out? Why is it so hard to implement if the code is already there when the Human player is on defense?

[Moostache2]

Great thoughts Rhombic!

I agree with just about everything...NCAA is a very good to borderline great game. If I had not played Madden 2009 right after it, I probably would be incredibly fired up for NCAA above Madden for the third year in a row...but I have to be honest here, the things that NCAA does not do terribly well were noticably better on Madden and despite the online Dynasty in NCAA, I believe Madden has overshadowed NCAA for the first time in years...

NCAA is still going to be a great game - it IS a ton of fun to play and head-to-head play against friends is gonna be a blast - I just think the pass rush and pass coverage issues will hold it back from true greatness for another year. Better than 2008? Undeniably! Better than Madden 2008? Absoliutely! Best available football game for 2009? I highly doubt it...but still a very worthy effort and something people SHOULD be fired up to get their hands on...

[fatcheerleader]

Thanks! I can't believe you traveled to and from, played 25 hours, and still managed to type this up for us, you're amazing. One question, who was at the event, meaning what companies, sites, magazines, etc were there to sample the game? You can PM me if you don't want to make it a public thing and don't mind sharing. I'm just curious. Thanks again.

[rhombic21]

Originally Posted by worst2first

Was QB Auto-Throw even discussed? Why was this left out? Why is it so hard to implement if the code is already there when the Human player is on defense?

Yes, this was discussed at length with Ben Haumiller, one of the lead NCAA feature producers. Auto-pass was on the radar for '09 and is high on the list of things to add in 2010. They didn't get it in the game because it turned out to be more technically complicated than they had time to do this year. It is more difficult to implement than it appears.

[rhombic21]

Originally Posted by fatcheerleader

Thanks! I can't believe you traveled to and from, played 25 hours, and still managed to type this up for us, you're amazing. One question, who was at the event, meaning what companies, sites, magazines, etc were there to sample the game? You can PM me if you don't want to make it a public thing and don't mind sharing. I'm just curious. Thanks again.

This was strictly a community event, so there weren't any companies or major gaming sites there.

Just off the top of my head, the other community sites there were:

Maddenwars (Shopmaster, Moostache)
VGSports (Kobra)
Madden University (TNT713)
Consolesports.net (Quietstorm)
Gametimephilly (Bobby Storm)
South Florida Madden Ballers (Boza)
Maddenmatrix (Mad Sci)
MaddenPlanet (Damon, AndyP)
Sportable (Sonny)

and Russell05MN, who is sort of a free agent and long-time vet of the CL program that posts at several major sites like OS and MM.

[kbell97]

Nice blog Rhombic, well done. If you could compare how close this game plays to any other past NCAA game ? 2004, 2005,2006, 2007?


How did the zone blocking running game feel?

[kbell97]

If I could practice one particular item from 2008 that might help me improve my own skill for 2009 what would you suggest?

[rudyjuly2]

Great write-up Rhombic. I thought the pass blocking sliders were broken on Heisman last year. If I can find a set that works vs. the cpu I will be happy. How much did you test sliders Rhombic vs. the cpu and on AA? Did you mess with the break block slider much or just the pass blocking slider?

I felt the cpu pass block was overpowered last year but I could tune it well on AA. On Heisman, the cpu pass block was far too good, even with pass block at 0 and human break block at 99. The game needs to have a pass rush with just four guys and I will do my best to achieve it.

[rhombic21]

A good example of how the new juke system can produce incredible plays, by AndyMP of Maddenplanet. This was the highlight play of the NCAA event, IMO.

http://www.vimeo.com/1101494

I think you guys are really going to love the way the game feels/controls.

[bigturboweenie]

thank you for the write-up...very in-depth...

and i too am tired of all these whiners saying that EA doesn't care about their products.

so i'll be looking forward to 09!!

[MightyBruin]

Originally Posted by rhombic21

A This was the highlight play of the NCAA event, IMO.

http://www.vimeo.com/1101494

I think you guys are really going to love the way the game feels/controls.

The game looks really fluid. I can't wait to actually get my hands on it. The player models also look so much better than 08. They aren't all roided up and huge.

Rhombic did the problems with undercenter playaction get fixed? Is the blocking better when calling a playaction pass?

[rhombic21]

Originally Posted by MightyBruin

Rhombic did the problems with undercenter playaction get fixed? Is the blocking better when calling a playaction pass?

Most definitely, although a part of that is probably due to the fact that blitzing just doesn't get a ton of pressure period, play action or no.

[Totalpackage83]

Rhombic, couple of questions....would you say 09 requires more user skills or less skills than 08? I see where you say this game feels more like a last-gen version of ncaa. I remember in last-gen when user skills particularly in the running game were very important. I hope that with all the new juke and running moves/animations this need for user skill isn't lost. I see where you say this system is pulled off very well so I can trust your word on that. In the passing game, how much do you think user skills can benefit a player (ex. user catching not spectacular catch or pass deflecting/interceptions)? I know you did have a huge amount of time with the game so if you can't answer I understand. Do you believe user skills are just as important as strategy in this game?

[rhombic21]

I think this game will definitely benefit those with stick skills more than '08 did, just because you have better control of your players on both offense and defense.

[22SEC]

What do you feel like is the reason the pass rush may be lacking this year? Is it just the way it is coded, good offensive play designs, poor defensive play design, player ratings? Any chance that the community with slider tweaks or rating adjustments may help tweak the issue?

[boomerj4sho]

Rhombic, 1st of all appreciate all of the info, thanks alot.

Do you think that in one on one situations if a DL is user controlled that you could get pressure on the QB?

Other than that did you happen to play with OU and how is there oline, since it is one of the elites, and how was there running game?